K11 Owners Group

WidgetMan · Joined: 23 Oct 2008 Posts: 11 Location: Derby, UK

Trying to research and resolve a stiff clutch pull got me to take apart the clutch in my '93 K1100LT TIC. I found the plates had no consistent set of balance marks.

So in order to validate the balance of the plates I came up with a solution to balance the plate set without having to run up the bike.

All I did was to run a set of experiments to balance combinations of the plates on a tennis ball that rested on a flat glass surface (the wife's best coffee table - best do it when she's out)

I started with the clutch housing. This confirmed the theory that whatever the starting orientation of the clutch housing (clutch side downwards and the centre resting on the tennis ball) the clutch housing consistently rested on the same spot.

The next experiment used the clutch housing and the housing cover. By changing the orientation of the housing cover a position was reached where the combination was able to balance evenly on the tennis ball. This was then confirmed by spinning the combination on the tennis ball and ensuring the unit did not touch the glass tabletop

I then marked up the combination using yellow acrylic paint (wargaming is another sad hobby of mine).

A final set of experiments was then done with the combination including the pressure plate. Again, by trial and error an orientation of the combination, including the pressure plate, maintained the balance point on the tennis ball.

A final blob of yellow paint and the combination could be broken up for refitting to the bike as normal.

This tennis ball method seems to work because the centre of gravity of the unit is kept just above the glass plate and if the ball is not that worn there is just a single point of contact with the table that is centred on the middle of the spline shaft.

I'll let you know if it works when the bike is reassenbled.

Hope this helps someone.
_________________
'93 K1100LT (tatty and ex-police - the bike, not me!!.)
K - 75,000 miles, me - 4000 miles.

slipperyox · Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 7:20 pm Post subject:

I had the same problem, My pressure plate was worn so i got a s/h one from motorworks.

I didn't loose sleep and just put it back together, I suggest that these bike vibrate so much anyway... that you wont notice if you get it right or wrong Razz

_________________
Luck is when planning and opportunity meet

Flying Duck · Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 7:27 pm Post subject:

If your clutch is stiff it may be caused by old stiff grease on the pivot rod bearings for the clutch arm.
_________________
93 LT (x2)
94 RS
86-97 K75F(K75/100/1100 Frankenbrick)
86 K75C w/paralever, hi perf cams,TURBO!
91 & 92 K75Ss
91 K1
86 custom K100
14 WR250R
IBA #17739 (SS1K, BBG, 50CC)
Buy parts HERE

SugarHillCTD · Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 7:54 pm Post subject:

Scott_Anderson · Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 9:32 pm Post subject:

Number 6 · Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 4:14 am Post subject:

Looks like a nice method, do you have pictures of the setup?
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I am not a number, I am a free man.

94 K1100LT

Trucker · Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 5:21 pm Post subject:

I hope the tennis ball was of the approved variety.

The specifications for tennis balls are defined by the International Tennis Federation (ITF). This means the ball must be a certain size and weight and made with certain materials. Tennis balls are made of 2-piece rubber cores that are cemented together. This is then covered with fabric, usually wool or synthetic felt. The seams between the two pieces of the core are exposed, but covered with elastic sealant.

The ITF defines the official diameter as "more than" 2 and 1/2 inches but "less than" 2 and 5/8 inches. The weight is "more than" 2 ounces but "less than" 2 and 1/16th ounces.

The rules also say that, when dropped onto a concrete base from 100 inches, the ball should bounce "more than" 53 inches but "less than" 58 inches. In order to achieve this, most balls are pressurized and filled with air.

Finally, the rules state that the "stiffness" of the balls, defined by how much they deform (curve in or out) at 18 lbs of pressure, must be "more than" .220 inches and "less than" .290 inches for forward deformation. For return deformation it must be "more than" .315 inches and "less than" .425 inches.

Because there is some "looseness" in the dimensions required for tennis balls, there is small, but noticeable differences between brands. Some balls are designed for hardcourt and grass, while others are designed for clay courts. The ball can vary by about 1/8 of an inch in size and 1/16th of an ounce in weight. Its rebound height can vary almost 10%. The stiffness, defined by the deformation under pressure, can vary over 5%. In addition, the rules do not say what material the cover should be, the thickness of the cover, or how tightly or loosely the fibers are woven.

An experienced player can instantly tell differences in balls, even though they all comply (follow) the legal specifications. Some balls are considered "lighter", "heavier", "harder", or "softer". Players find it takes more effort or less to generate the same ball speed. Some balls seem springier and bounce higher. The cover can seem coarser or thicker. With some balls, the cover fluffs up much sooner during match play, seeming to slow down in flight through the air.

Most of the major tournaments are played with different brands of balls, designed especially for the different court surfaces. One of the questions the team investigated at Key Biscayne was did any of the differences in balls, mentioned in the previous paragraph, really make a "difference" in professional tennis tournaments

So the burning question is,, which type of tennis ball will give the most accurate balance.

Answers on a postcard please,,,,, Very Happy

.

Cheers.

Rich.
_________________
1993 K1100LTIC.

2011 Triumph Sprint GT

Mystic Red · Posted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 10:03 pm Post subject:

Geez Rich, are you locked in somewhere? Laughing

_________________
Scott Hespelt, '94 K11LT
K11 OG #466

tmoons · Flying Brick Rider Joined: 09 Oct 2008 Posts: 161

I've done it, taken the clutch apart and had it balanced (cost me 75 euro)
the guy who did it, told me he first balanced all the seperate parts and than the whole thing together.
he found hardly any (of not none at all) inbalance.
certenly nothing you would notice. this was a clucht that had been in operation for 55 k miles.

This would also mean that taking it appart, and refiting it in random orientation would just be fine.

Number 6 · Posted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 6:34 am Post subject:

SugarHillCTD · Posted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 6:42 am Post subject:

malcolmt · Posted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 5:45 pm Post subject:

Trucker · Posted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 9:29 pm Post subject:

Mystic Red · Posted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 10:23 pm Post subject:

_________________
Scott Hespelt, '94 K11LT
K11 OG #466

Flying Duck · Posted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 10:37 pm Post subject:

It's my understanding that the housing and pressure plate assembly were balanced separately at the factory. (Though it can't hurt to mark all three parts when disassembling.)

Just install the clutch without the clutch plate and start the bike. Put a glass of water on the tail cowl and watch the ripples as a visual indication of how much it's vibrating. Stop it and turn the outer plate 120 degrees. Start it again and repeat. Then rotate it another 120 degrees and do it again. That should tell you what the most balanced relative orientation of the pressure plates is.

I always mark them so have never needed to resort to this but I'm pretty sure it would produce good results.
_________________
93 LT (x2)
94 RS
86-97 K75F(K75/100/1100 Frankenbrick)
86 K75C w/paralever, hi perf cams,TURBO!
91 & 92 K75Ss
91 K1
86 custom K100
14 WR250R
IBA #17739 (SS1K, BBG, 50CC)
Buy parts HERE

malcolmt · Posted: Sat Feb 26, 2011 10:32 am Post subject:

I suspect Drikko would have better results using a glass of beer on the tail.
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A Bike on the road is worth two
in the shed
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Flying Duck · Posted: Sat Feb 26, 2011 10:35 am Post subject:

SugarHillCTD · Posted: Sat Feb 26, 2011 12:16 pm Post subject:

Rafal · Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 8:48 am Post subject:

Flying Duck · Posted: Mon Feb 28, 2011 12:06 pm Post subject: