K11 Owners Group

Ernie-NH · Posted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:31 pm Post subject: K1100 tranny question,,,

Good afternoon all...

OK... I know I've asked this question before, but I'll try again. Does anyone understand WHY the K1100 transmissions sound like a "box of rocks" ?? Being deaf I dont really notice it, but my wife asked me what is the rattly sound. I have compared the design of my old R100/7 transmission with the K-design displayed in the Clymer and dont see any significant differences, yet my R100/7 has none of the "rattly/loose" sounds coming from it ! Per Phil's suggestion I have switched to 80-140 fluid, but still the "falling apart" sound and slight vibration persists. The machine runs great, shifts perfectly, nothing out of the ordinary, but still the "box of rocks" sound when at speeds. A renowned "Airhead" guru told me that there may be a design flaw in the "k-bike" transmission, yet BMW shop mechanics tell me "they all sound that way"....

So IF anyone knows why or what might be done, maybe you could tell all of us...eh? To me a transmission should be smooth and nearly silent. Any thoughts ??

Best regards..............// Ernie-NH
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'11 G650gs
'95 K1100LT
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Shoganai · Posted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 3:47 pm Post subject: Re: K1100 tranny question,,,

RAL88 · Posted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 5:46 pm Post subject:

My K does not sound like a "box of rocks" at all. Even if I am lugging it it does not make a sound like that.
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Rich

"If it ain't broke, take it apart and make it work better"
*************
'96' K1100LT-SE
'97' R850GS-R

Ernie-NH · Posted: Sat Jun 26, 2010 7:12 am Post subject:

Good morning Gwen... Good morning Rich...!

Thanks for the responses... Re: " They all do that !", I've gotten to the point that as soon as I hear that coming out of a mechanics mouth, I simply ignore and walk away ! A comment like that means nothing more than " I dont know, have no interest in knowing, and dont care!"

Rich I'm glad your's is "on the money" but as you see from Gwens response and a few other responses in other threads, that is not always the case and that there is in fact SOMETHING going on.

The fact that Gwen's did "rattle" before replacing the Input Shaft, and the 'newbee' in Scotland who complains about the same thing, and "Midlands Tim" (UK) response concerning the "Balancer/Input Shaft" design on the other end.... makes me suspect 'bearing end-play'... but wont know until the end of riding season and then I'll let you all know.

Who knows.... maybe I'll have this resolved in time for HM-lV ????

Thanks again for your input here........// Ernie-NH
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AMA,, American Deaf Bikers
Airhead Beemers Club
'11 G650gs
'95 K1100LT
'76 R100/7

kstones · Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 7:42 am Post subject: Noisy box.

No they don't all do that. but finding out what it is can be difficult. Sounds like your post season plans to do deep surgery will find out what, but mine is quiet as are others' listed above. Lately i had a lot of noise like rattly clutch, mechanical things, and i wondered if it was in the guts then i noticed a crack in No3 downtube to the silencer. I got it welded up and the whole shemozzle is just decibels quieter now - like it used to be, none of those noises! I had a K75 and it was noisy and i got "they all do that" and the clutch centre splines failed in another country so don't accept the dictum which only means they can't figure it out. You've got to have confidence of knowing it's ok. Trust your own judgement, it's as good/better than others though using advice is a good idea too.
Tony.

Ernie-NH · Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:56 am Post subject:

Good morning Tony....

Thanks... I haven't checked the exhaust adequately BUT will do that today. Could be...? Will keep you posted.

Very best regards.........// Ernie-NH
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AMA,, American Deaf Bikers
Airhead Beemers Club
'11 G650gs
'95 K1100LT
'76 R100/7

Ted · Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:56 am Post subject:

Howdy Ernie,

Glad to hear you made it home safe and sound (still waiting for pics from the trip Smile

) - do you run synthetic oil in the trans?
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Ted

KOG#1

Tim (Midland Section) · Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 7:10 pm Post subject:

Drive shaft Phasing ??
Engine Gbox bolts tight ??
A mate had a K75 with a seeming gearbox fault. Eventually he borrowed a rear wheel to test & changed his tyre soon after.
Hope you find something.
My 95 K was always quieter than the 91 & the 97. Just clocked up 20K miles on the 97 so it isn't terminal.
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Grey haired riders don't get that way by pure luck
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1972 750 Commando
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Ernie-NH · Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:41 pm Post subject:

Hi Ted....

Yes... I use all the fluids recommended by Phil, and currently have Mobil 75-140 in the Tranny.. The Tranny and Drive train were pulled to install new clutch and "O" ring, plus Spline lube, just before the HM-lll ( which made me a day late ) I've checked the exhaust 'down tubes' for cracks as suggested, nothing there! But this winter I will pull the tranny to check it out ! I might add, that despite the two times I've fallen over, ( training wheels anyone ?? ) the bike runs great and no transient or unusual vibrations to notice. As a deaf person, I'm very tuned in to vibrations of any sort and there is nothing here out of the ordinary. The "box of rocks" sound(s) were described to me by my wife, I mentioned it to the BMW technician who rode the bike, and he acknowledged the sound BUT then came out with the infamous " they all do that" statement which I don't believe. However I WILL investigate this winter after HL-ll !

Best regards all.............// Ernie-NH
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AMA,, American Deaf Bikers
Airhead Beemers Club
'11 G650gs
'95 K1100LT
'76 R100/7

Flying Duck · Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2010 10:57 pm Post subject:

Both of mine do that.
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94 RS
86-97 K75F(K75/100/1100 Frankenbrick)
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91 & 92 K75Ss
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Neiljohn · Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 24

Hopefully it's not going to lead to this:

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4025/4717755431_157704ac4d_b.jpg

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4021/4717751757_e87af8e992_b.jpg

Momentary rear wheel lock-up until the dogs failed at high speed, cause, badly rebuilt gearbox and selector fork drum pin shearing off!

Ernie-NH · Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 10:27 am Post subject:

Good morning "NJ"....

On your tranny "rebuild/failure" were there any precursors or warnings prior to the failure ?? What were the reasons leading up to your rebuild, and did you do the rebuild yourself ?? Any info would be helpful to all of us !!

Thanks.......and best regards.// Ernie-NH
_________________
AMA,, American Deaf Bikers
Airhead Beemers Club
'11 G650gs
'95 K1100LT
'76 R100/7

Neiljohn · Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 24

Good Evening Ernie,

The box started dropping out of and back into 2nd when hot, mainly under load (both ways) and false neutraling between 4th and 5th at odd times, so I picked up a cheap because the clutch splines were worn low mileage used box via e-bay about 6 months ago.

I found the original box had been 'rebuilt' before I'd bought the bike last year, by the red paint splash inside the front of the casing, a circlip under one of the front case bolts instead of a washer and sealant spewing out of the 'dry' casing joint, after it had failed. The selectors pin bearing was missing, I found the pin in the debris, I suspect it had been missed out during the 'rebuild', as its an Ex-Police K1100LTIC and had been in private hands before mine I have no idea who or when it was done. The clutch looks almost brand new, so it might have been recently...

The used box has been apart on MY bench and the input shaft from the damaged box fitted as its clutch splines were in much better condition, other than that the used box was in very nice condition and clean inside and out!

Box was fitted last weekend and filled with fully synthetic 75/90 tonight, run for a minute of so to check changes, all seems OK, just one exhaust stud to sort out... Then full reassembly this coming weekend!

I had to make a support frame for the bike to work on it, links below:

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4056/4720440870_e017e31ce1_b.jpg

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4011/4710430638_543b50cc23_b.jpg

Ernie-NH · Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 6:02 pm Post subject:

Good evening NJ

Great "input" and description..!! Very helpful for all, and compliments on the neat 'uni-strut' stand,, it'll come in handy in the future as well !

Thanks and best regards.........// Ernie-NH

PS: When you get time, you might complete your 'sig line' and let us know where you are located.
_________________
AMA,, American Deaf Bikers
Airhead Beemers Club
'11 G650gs
'95 K1100LT
'76 R100/7

SugarHillCTD · Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2010 6:56 pm Post subject:

Ernie,

I had the trans "noise" in certain situations. Phil will verify this- matter of fact he was the one who first had me thinking about it. On one particular occasion.

It happened last fall on the first day of HL. Phil and I rode down to Saltcreek's farm to meet the others. He and I stopped at the traffic light when we exited the interstate. He asked me about the noise (it was that B of R sound) he was hearing- my K was in neutral, clutch lever out. I replied that I could stop the noise by pulling in the clutch while leaving it in neutral.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it- hopefully Phil might verify.

John

jpberens1994K1100RS · Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 6:09 am Post subject: support stand

" I had to make a support frame for the bike to work on it, links below: "

That's a pretty neat stand you put together. Cool

I like the slide lock adjusters, if you have a few minutes to spare< maybe you could share where you got them from. And the aluminum channel as well.

Just curious is all.
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1993 K1100RS that I'd rather be riding FAST!
2014 Moto Guzzi Norge

Neiljohn · Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 24

jpberens1994K1100RS · Posted: Fri Jul 02, 2010 6:53 am Post subject: Support

Thank you!

Nice and mostly free! Hard to beat.

Nice job on the trans too BTW.
_________________
1993 K1100RS that I'd rather be riding FAST!
2014 Moto Guzzi Norge

Neiljohn · Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 24

Neiljohn · Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 24

Rode to and from work today, having replaced the shaft last night.

Total parts cost, box and shaft, less than the diesel to fuel my Land-Rover for commuting since it all went t*ts-up!

'New' (used) box change is crisp, minimal lever movement required to shift (unlike the old box), and accurate, no false neutrals. Quiet too, though the fully synthetic 75w/90 probably helps?
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Southern Hampshire, England.

'95 K1100LTIC (ex-police) my first road bike after 20 years without a road bike! Now backed up by an F650GS (800 twin) and a Deauville. The '52 G80C isn't a road bike so doesn't count...