K11 Owners Group

stpenroute · Joined: 25 Jul 2010 Posts: 10 Location: Huntington, NY

Update: After extracting a 2341 code (O2 sensor at it limit) from the Motronic, and replacing the O2 sensor with a new one, the missing at 3000 rpm is gone. Remaining is a condition where it now pulls strong up until 4500 rpm, then feels as though it drops 1 or 2 cylinders. A TPS test and a fuel pressure test are now in order. This is becoming akin to tuning a Turbo Hayabusa... dialing in more boost with just the right amount of ignition retard to squelch knock and keep from holing pistons while not blowing the tire away completely and losing good 60 footers... he he he. But this is a "touring bike" with only 40,000 miles on it! Are these just crappy bikes, unecessarily complicated, slow to respond to wrenching and hard to get parts for, or, have I been dealing with Jappers and Harleys for too long?

I'm about ready to call Joe Hahn and Skip from Orient Express if the next few things I try don't work. He he he... really, I haven't had a bike apart this much and this deep all without making much headway since I stopped drag racing! Talk about futility... Jesus Christ!

(Thanx for letting me blow off some steam!)

Scott
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STP

1994 K1100 LT
2-wheeled Barco-lounger - "Blue Suede"

1984 Harley-Davidson XLX-61
Flamed Chopper - "Ole Reliable"

m1ks · Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 8:35 pm Post subject:

I'm interested in your findings, I have a similar prob with mine currently.

Mines a 95 LT SE with 105,000 miles on it so a smidge more than yours.
It ran absolutely fine from purchase, (couple of niggles to sort like the water / oil pump seal replaced), just recently it started behaving like yours, it's always around the 4K to 5k rpm band BUT only when warm and under relatively hard acceleration, (I say relatively as i'm not talking yanking the throttle to the stop but as you would to sharply overtake a car or two in front).
The only different factors just before this occurred being:
Replaced the air filter, (hence the interest in your 02 sensor comment), and spark plugs from Bosch double electrode things to NGK, the fault occurred after replacing, riding to work and then started as I was almost home on the return journey, first thought was the plugs so I whipped them out and put the old uns back in but same story.
The other possible factor was that i'd filled up in a different filling station and subsequently heard that a couple of people had had fuel grumbles, but this was at the back end of the tank and have since run about three tanks from the old station and replaced the fuel filter.
These things are service items I was replacing anyway so no matter but it's frutrating, recently the weather here has been poor and the bike outdoors so not been able to dig into it.
Just replaced the front tyre today and had a quick run to start scrubbing it in and the fault is still there, opened the throttle a bit more on a nice open clear bit of road and it felt like it was missing higher in the rev range in top, sort of one cylinder missing every other revolution.
If I accelerate gently it seems to pull through the 4 - 5 rpm band OK and likewise OK when first started and warming up, starts idles and revs cleanly.

Still to do on mine service related is the valve clearences and rear driveshaft lube.
I had toyed with the thought it could be a coil breaking down under load at high speed with the heat, (have known this with old jap bikes before) but just have a feeling it's fuelling related, I'd have refitted the old air filter to try but unfortunately I binned it straightaway.

SO you're not on your own there, I'd love to figure out the problem, have talked to a BMW specialist (via phone as I live in a remote place), and he didn't have a clue other than suggesting all the things i've checked myself.
As an aside, can you run through your testing procedure with the temp light, I tried mine ages ago and could not get it to do what it should.

Mike
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Flying Duck · Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 8:38 pm Post subject:

Check the resistance of your spark plug leads and make sure they're firmly seated on the plugs.
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94 RS
86-97 K75F(K75/100/1100 Frankenbrick)
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stpenroute · Joined: 25 Jul 2010 Posts: 10 Location: Huntington, NY

Ok... here's the NEW DEAL.

After everything done so far:
1) new spark plug wires - Magnecore
2) new spark plugs - Bosch
3) new fuel filter
4) new air filer
5) fresh gas 2x
6) new vacuum distribution hoses (dealer installed)
7) checked, rechecked, and tri-checked all electrical & vacuum connections.
8 ) checked codes - all but O2 sensor ok
9) O2 sensor replaced with new
10) new fork seals, bushings, springs, dust caps, and fluid (has nothing to do with anything but I thought I'd mention it anyway)
11) Half bottle of Techron in tank.

After the new O2 sensor went in it stopped missing at 3500.
After the half bottle of Techron went in it only misses around 5500 - 6000 rpm now, and then clears up! It idles smooth as a baby's bottom and pulls like an animal between 3000-5500 and 6500 +!

Dirty fuel injectors???? I dunno. Sounds like some ad-related/marketing crap, but I'm going to try Sea Foam next as I hear it's a bit stronger than Techron and see what happens. I'll keep you posted.

This is tedious.

Scott
_________________
STP

1994 K1100 LT
2-wheeled Barco-lounger - "Blue Suede"

1984 Harley-Davidson XLX-61
Flamed Chopper - "Ole Reliable"

Jimmyd · Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 3:10 am Post subject: Re: Missing...

jpberens1994K1100RS · Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 6:37 am Post subject: not missing

Problems like yours can be tough to sort out.

Crappy bike though?

Possibly overly complicated and twitchy at times, but crappy no.

I think you are going to find that your fuel system is or was compromised being dirty.

Some may get away with negelect, but bewtween the aluminum tank, all those hose connections and the trapped heat, it's best to err on the side of caution.
Use the Techron cleaner all the time. When I bought my bike the PO had only ridden it about 2,000 miles in eight years! Had all the reocrds maintainence records though. On my six hour ride home the bike just would not pull past 4,000 with out lots of stumbling. I ran the gas as low as I dared then filled up and used Sea Foam and kept using it for a couple weeks. Problem solved.
My 93 RS is a daily commuter.

Stupid friggin bike just runs and wants more & more running.

Wound her up tight on the way home from work last night. Road was clear, dry, wide open. Just pegged it cause it IS so fun! About 48,000 miles on mine,

Hope you get it sorted out.
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1993 K1100RS that I'd rather be riding FAST!
2014 Moto Guzzi Norge

SugarHillCTD · Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 8:34 am Post subject:

Jimmyd,

I'm a bit north of you in northern N.H. If I haven't done so already, I first want to say Hello & WELCOME.

What Jim just suggested sounds like it could be what's ailing your brick.

Have you had the gas tank off yet? While you have replaced the fuel lines inside, could there be a kinked line behind the throttle bodies under the tank?

Otherwise, (and I know you have checked connections) look at the TWO ground wire connections to the engine- the obvious one just above the shift lever and a second one just in front of and below the battery- it is really buried in there and hard to see. The bolt is vertical and tightened from above.
Someone may correct me and say that a '94 doesn't have this second connection- my experience is with '93 and '92 (the '93 was how I found out about the consequences of it being loose)

Good luck,
John
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'92 K100RS4V Pearl White SOLD
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Jimmyd · Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 11:07 pm Post subject:

Scott_Anderson · Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 7:59 am Post subject:

Jimmy, it's possible that your HES(hall effect sensor) sensor could be on it's way out. That's what tells the motronic the crankshaft position.
It is known to flake out as the bike warms up and it gets hot. Not all that common but it does happen.
Some test it by removing the front T shaped cover and heating it up with a hair dryer or heat gun to see if it faults when the bike is otherwise cold.
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1995 K1100LT 0302044
2017 FLHTK Ultra Limited
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1997 K1100LT 0302488(R.I.P.)
1997 R1100RT ZC62149(sold)

ackgs · Joined: 07 Aug 2010 Posts: 15 Location: S.E. Mass

How about your fuel filter and/or injectors? When I got my K75 it was not running and had not run in a while. Lots of crud in the tank and even after cleaning and sending the injectors out for service I would occasionally develop a miss when I got on it above 4K. Back off and no miss. Changed out the fuel filter and solved the problem. The last time it happened I had recently had the tank off also. I think the tank removal stirs up crud in the tank, puts it in suspension and it gets trapped in the filter. Or maybe not. Just a thought. I cut the filter open and it was filled with a putty like substance, a very fine grit. I think another filter of two will get it cleaned out. It is running very well presently.

As for the warmed up part, when I was first getting the bike going again it would run better cold and when it warmed up I would get a miss. At that point it was the injectors. I don't know why it would run better cold but did. A visit to Mr. Injector solved that. After that the new miss was caused by the clogged filter described above.

Mystic Red · Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2011 9:47 pm Post subject:

Good maintenance is about once a year, when your gas supply is low, is to clean out your tank. Take it off and dump out the gas that's left after siphoning and rinse with fresh gas.
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Scott Hespelt, '94 K11LT
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Jimmyd · Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 9:49 pm Post subject: Still Stuttering

Ok
Have now done the following
Replaced:
Battery
Plugs. Plug wires, Internal fuel lines, fuel filter.
Cleaned air filter (looked pretty good)
Checked TPS..... seems right on the money at .393 volts.
Ran bottle of blue Stabil through tank
I really don't want to mess with the hall sensor, but I guess that's pretty much all that is left. or the O2 sensor. I'll see if I can get the diagnositc codes to work to track down what's left as possible issues.
I bought an 02 sensor (used) and have had it sittng around. I think I'll put that in a see what happens.
I keep getting the same issue. Bike stumbles at about 5 K after it warms up, then gets progressivley worse till I get flaky performance at all RPMS. Seems to idle pretty smooth and bike pulls nicely up to about 80 MPH.
Slight release and re engaging the throttle seems to help but it seems like it just won't smoothly pass 80 MPH at about 5k on the tach.
Almost forgot, I had the injectors clean by Mr Injector. Nice job and showed one injector was a little off at about 8% below the flow rate of the others.

I guess it could be the fuel pump too???
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1994 K 1100 RS

Scott_Anderson · Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 10:48 pm Post subject:

Or possibly the fuel pressure regulator on it's way out. Only way to see that is to put some pressure guages in the fuel line to read.
_________________
Ride safe.

1995 K1100LT 0302044
2017 FLHTK Ultra Limited
Garmin StreetPilot 2820
Garmin Zumo 550
Garmin Zumo XT
"One who does not ask questions is ashamed to learn" Danish proverb
1997 K1100LT 0302488(R.I.P.)
1997 R1100RT ZC62149(sold)