K11 Owners Group

jay k. · Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2015 6:58 pm Post subject: 5.5" Rear Wheel

I found a 5.5" rear wheel, and had it shod with a Pilot Road 4...180/55/17.
I just mounted it onto the bike ('96 K1100RS)with 2 OEM spacers.
I thought, based on other threads, that I would have to grind the swing arm a but for clearance. But as it sits on the center stand I have a solid 1/4" between the sidewall and the paralever arm at 36psi.
Maybe I got lucky with the size and profile?
Can I expect so much deformity under load that it will rub? I would expect most deformity to occur at or near the contact patch.
How much clearance would you think is good?
I suppose I could ride it a bit and then remove the wheel and check for marks from rubbing.
Any thoughts???
Thank - Jay
_________________
'20 R1250RS - The RS
'96 K1100RS/SE - The Bagger
'05 R1100S Boxer Cup Replica - The Boxer
'14 Ducati Monster 1200S - The Duc
'84 Kawasaki GPz 1100 - The Gypsy

Scott_Anderson · Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2015 8:33 pm Post subject:

N41EF · Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2015 10:20 pm Post subject:

How much thread engagement do you have wih the two spacers? Or did you use longer wheel lugs?

Put a piece of the blue painter's tape on the inside of the swingarm, if you have ANY rubbing, the tape will tear up pretty bad. You can stick your finger along the edge and feel if the tape is messed up.
_________________
2014 R1200RT Water Cooled
2001 R1100S Light
1993 K1100LT. Nissan Ice Blue.(Gone)

SugarHillCTD · Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2015 5:37 am Post subject:

Jay,

With the lack of new (PR 4) tires in 18" size, I have thought of doing the same thing.

My question is what is the rolling circumference difference between the stock size 18" wheel/tire and your new 17" size?

I would not want to increase rpms at highway speed since IMHO it already revs pretty high- 5000 rpm @ 75 mph

But I like what you did. I am also interested in any changes to handling with the wider tire.

John
_________________
John & Cathy

'92 K100RS4V Pearl White SOLD
'04 K1200GT
IBA Several-SS1k, BBG, 50CC NYC to S.F.

rbm · Posted: Sun Jun 28, 2015 5:39 pm Post subject:

Have you seen the write-up on this site about the K1200 wheel conversion on a K1100RS?

SugarHillCTD · Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2015 6:03 am Post subject:

Thanks Robert. I had completely forgotten about Allen's conversion/post.

Allen did mention that it makes the bike sit lower at the rear- not much but it will "slow" the steering down a bit. And it was a bit more difficult to use the center stand.

One thought there- The boxer cup that I previously owned had a shorter rear brake reaction arm (is that the proper name? The fiche calls it a "silver rod") than the non-sport rear suspension. 365mm vs. 385mm.

Using that shorter arm actually achieves 2 things. First it slightly speeds up the steering. It also reduces the rear U-joint angle.

I wonder if something like this would work on our K bikes.

Here are 2 pictures to illustrate the difference. The first is with the 365mm arm.

The 385mm arm

_________________
John & Cathy

'92 K100RS4V Pearl White SOLD
'04 K1200GT
IBA Several-SS1k, BBG, 50CC NYC to S.F.

jay k. · Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2015 6:28 am Post subject:

Regarding the circumference; I am not so worried about the speedo given that it's already off by 10%.
I've dropped the forks to compensate for the height difference in the two set-ups. The rear wheel is noticeably off-center. I'm anxious to see how that works!!! Other threads claim it has no noticeable affect.
I'll report on how it works when I get it all together. I hit a deer last year and used the rebuild as and excuse to go through the bike; rebuilt fork and new shock set up for me and my riding style, braided stainless brake lines, the rear wheel. Hopefully I can finish reassembling the bodywork this week.
_________________
'20 R1250RS - The RS
'96 K1100RS/SE - The Bagger
'05 R1100S Boxer Cup Replica - The Boxer
'14 Ducati Monster 1200S - The Duc
'84 Kawasaki GPz 1100 - The Gypsy

jay k. · Posted: Mon Jun 29, 2015 6:32 am Post subject:

I forgot to mention that Beachcomber, who is a member here, is manufacturing an adjustable strut arm for the r1100s bikes. He says he might be willing to do the same for the bricks if there is sufficient interest. I.e. 5 or more.
_________________
'20 R1250RS - The RS
'96 K1100RS/SE - The Bagger
'05 R1100S Boxer Cup Replica - The Boxer
'14 Ducati Monster 1200S - The Duc
'84 Kawasaki GPz 1100 - The Gypsy

jay k. · Posted: Wed Jul 15, 2015 2:13 pm Post subject:

Just to follow up...(and some of this I've copied over from another related thread.)
I finally got the bike all together and have put almost 400+/- miles on it since Sunday, including all types of roads -- from tight twisties right up to a 135mph (indicated - so 120 or so) stint on a 4-lane highway.
I have removed the two spacers as the wheel looked offset a crazy amount to the left of the bikes center-line. Even without any spacers the wheel looks offset. There is precious little space between the wheel and the swingarm, but there is no indication of rubbing on the tire. I haven't pulled the wheel to look at the swingarm...but if it was rubbing I'm sure the tire would show it. I don't know how far exactly it's offset; the right way to check is with a jig and I haven't had time to build one. The BMW Shop Manual specifies a tolerance of up to 12mm or 1/2" offset.
The visible offset caused large amounts of stress between the time I mounted the wheel and when I finally got to actually ride the bike. Total waste of time...the bike rides and handles great...and it tracks straight as an arrow. Turn-in effort is the same in each direction. I have pushed the chicken strip on the back wheel all the way to the edge of the tire already...after not having ridden this bike in almost two years.
Just before I took it off the road (hit a deer) I had the fork rebuilt with Race-Tec springs and heavier oil, and I put a Hyper-Shock, custom-built for me, on the back. I also just replaced all the soft brake lines with braided stainless lines from Speigler. To compensate for the shorter rear wheel I have raised the fork tubes 1/2" in the yokes.
Bottom line - I'm loving this thing. Neither my Boxer-Cup or the Ducati have left the garage this week. I mean...it's a 20 year old bike...but it's a great 20 year old bike. Looking forward to a long tour west this summer.
_________________
'20 R1250RS - The RS
'96 K1100RS/SE - The Bagger
'05 R1100S Boxer Cup Replica - The Boxer
'14 Ducati Monster 1200S - The Duc
'84 Kawasaki GPz 1100 - The Gypsy

andytgriff · Posted: Wed Jul 15, 2015 5:42 pm Post subject:

Jay, how about some pictures so we can see the effect ?

jay k. · Posted: Tue Jul 28, 2015 5:25 pm Post subject:

Beachcomber · Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2015 7:29 am Post subject:

JayK and others .....

Here's the RAMLEVER - adjustable paralever strut we developed for the Oilheads.

Raise to sharpen steering - lower [ GS models ] so vertically challenged peeps like me can reach the ground !

The same theory applies to Paralever Kays - and works just as well.

We will have to check out the end clevis and ball joint to ensure it's the same as the Kays - that being so, it's only a matter of having a batch of shorter main struts made - simples.

As to the rear wheel and offset - load of cobblers spouted about this over the years. Let's get one thing clear - BMW offset front / rear tracks as a matter of course. They've been doing it since Airhead days. Just think about it - the Kay's rear wheels range from 3.5" to 5". ALL fitted to the same chassis / swingarm. I was very concerned about this when I got involved with Kays some 10 years ago [ really as long as that ! ] as I am an auto design engineer and work to very precise measurements and geometry. Just didn't seem right. My first response was to offset the drivetrain to align my new 5.5" rear wheel, then I read an article on a German forum on precisely what we're talking about.

Never the less - my first trip with the 5.5" wheel installed was taken very gingerly at first - and almost as soon - forgotten !

In the UK there is NO requirement either in construction and use [ and Germany BTW ] or our annual MOT test for the front and rear wheels to be on the same track - parallel - yes - same track - no. BMW wheels come with offsets built into the hub / rim, but obviously there is a limit to that.

I'm currently finalising R1200S 5 spoke wheels for my Kay 100 based Fighter - together with K1100 front end to give me 4 pot braking.

In the real World IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE. The test mule was wragged around various race tracks while testing the RAMSHOX - all with the 5.5" rear wheel. Ben Kingham is still winning B.E.A.R.S. championship with the larger rear wheel - and RAMSHOX of course.

RAMSTRUT

And this is exactly the offset with a 5.5" wheel.

_________________
Beachcomber '93 K1100RS / '93 K1100LT and several K100's

jay k. · Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2015 3:27 pm Post subject:

I'd be glad to buy a ramlever from you...if it fits the K-bike.
I raised the fork tubes 1/2" in the triple trees to compensate for the shorter rear wheel.
But I would love to bring it back up to normal ground clearance.
_________________
'20 R1250RS - The RS
'96 K1100RS/SE - The Bagger
'05 R1100S Boxer Cup Replica - The Boxer
'14 Ducati Monster 1200S - The Duc
'84 Kawasaki GPz 1100 - The Gypsy

Beachcomber · Posted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:08 am Post subject:

jay k. · Posted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 4:29 pm Post subject:

Sweet...keep me posted.
_________________
'20 R1250RS - The RS
'96 K1100RS/SE - The Bagger
'05 R1100S Boxer Cup Replica - The Boxer
'14 Ducati Monster 1200S - The Duc
'84 Kawasaki GPz 1100 - The Gypsy

rgscomp · Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2015 4:52 am Post subject:

Yes, I'm interested also. I have the RAM shock and springs already. Adjusting the linkage to alter steering feel was something I used to do on my ST4 and ST4S Ducatis. Would be good to have same thing on the K.

jay k. · Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:34 pm Post subject:

SugarHillCTD · Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2015 5:44 pm Post subject: